Why IKEMEN is NOT the future people think it is... for now anyways

[JaaShooUhh]

I'll just give an in-depth take from my experience as someone who has played every version of MUGEN (including that dog shit called PainTown).

Anyways, the reality is this... MUGEN, despite being OLD, benefits from being OLD.

 

 

First off, it is compatible with MORE devices and systems than IKEMEN. The fact that I can't even run IKEMEN on my phone, yet I am able to play PS Vita games and Xbox 360 games on my phone, says a lot about how poorly handled IKEMEN has been.

 

 

Secondly, because it is so new, this also means that most people are NOT going to learn how to program for it. It is the same reason why MOST people don't make characters in other fighting game engines, like Knuckle Fighter, EF-12, 2D Fighter Maker 2nd, Schwarzerblitz, etc.

 

It takes a LOT of effort to pursue something new, that is either currently DEAD (Knuckle Fighter), DYING (2D Fighter Maker 2nd), or BARELY ALIVE (IKEMEN). People who have devoted years of their life, are NEVER going to move to IKEMEN unless absolutely necessary for a VERY SPECIFIC feature.

 

 

Thirdly, if characters made in MUGEN are COMPATIBLE with IKEMEN, then coding MUGEN characters is still the better option, because then they are compatible with MUGEN as well, making them MORE LIKELY to be used in the first place.

 

This is the same reason why MOST people do NOT make Mortal Kombat characters, because the MKP community took it over and basically killed it. Only a VERY SMALL handful of creators made NON-MKP versions of characters, because prior to them, there was NEVER any coding for making fatalities, brutalities, animalities, and stage fatalities, cause all of it was for goddamn obnoxious ass MKP.

 

 

Fourthly, aside from VERY SPECIFIC features and ONLINE play (which most people won't do in the first place due to how UNBALANCED MUGEN is to begin with), there really are no good reasons to use IKEMEN.

 

Its the same reason why most people don't make MUGEN 1.1 characters either, because the ZOOM feature ruins their characters and makes them less compatible with older versions of MUGEN.

 

 

Lastly, when MOST projects on IKEMEN are just re-ports of prior MUGEN content, there isn't a whole lot there to look forward to. There are only a VERY SMALL number of ORIGINAL games made on IKEMEN, the rest are just ports of existing content to be played on IKEMEN because of the extra features (like the built-in tag system, which can be done on MUGEN using the unotag patcher).

 

 

So yeah... IKEMEN, currently lacks the motivation needed to move over to it, especially since IKEMEN specific characters cannot be used on MUGEN, which means most people are NEVER going to see them.

 

Also every MUGEN community still identifies as a MUGEN community, not an IKEMEN community. In fact, I can't even name an IKEMEN website, cause I've never fucking heard of them.

 

I've heard of MUGEN Guild, MUGEN [that one site we don't name], MUGEN Free For all, and others... never heard of an IKEMEN Guild or IKEMEN Archive or an IKEMEN Free For All.

Until IKEMEN becomes BACKWARDS compatible and playable on more devices (such as a phone), there is really no reason for MOST MUGEN players to move over.

 

Hell, I can't even compliment IKEMEN on anything, because I still have no fucking way to play it. Can't run it on WinLator (a WINDOWS emulator, that allows me to even play STEAM games on it) for no goddamn reason and there is no Android port.

 

Also, the fact that we can't use cheap characters AT ALL, makes IKEMEN even more lame. Hell, there are winMUGEN patches that let me use 1.0 characters on them and even ways to downgrade 1.0 and 1.1 characters back to winMUGEN simply by editing some code.

 

Guess what I can't do... run a single goddamn IKEMEN specific character on any MUGEN game. Know why? Cause all files are different, all the coding is different.

[PlasmoidThunder]

Very uninformed take tbh. It can be summarised as "it does not appeal to me based on a surface level understanding therefore it sucks".

 

While IKEMEN features an optional new code language more akin to traditional ones, it is not required, so CNS can still be used and supports all the new triggers, sctrls, and parameters; what the new language offers is code optimisation, temporary variables, functions, and loops, among other things. You're looking at it from the perspective of a player/spectator and not a developer, so obviously the plethora of new features aimed at developers are meaningless to you, but a godsend to them. MUGEN is terrible for actual game development, in part because of all the hardcoded features (that are freely editable in IKEMEN!), but also because you can't even sell the finished product (there's IKEMEN games already on Steam!).

 

Is not being able use cheap characters really an issue? That particular brand uses memory exploits that cannot (and should not) be made to work engine-side because neither engine shares any compiled code, so it's all different under the hood and the memory addresses don't align. You'd face this with any MUGEN clone.

 

If all you want to do is watch A.I. cockfights then stick with MUGEN. There isn't anything any engine could offer to enhance that experience.

[Meldo]

you say IKEMEN GO barely has any games made with it when the actual number of games is more significant than you think.

 

also how can you say you've experienced the engine when you never actually played it?

 

 

[Randombambifan2]

7 hours ago, PlasmoidThunder said:

Very uninformed take tbh. It can be summarised as "it does not appeal to me based on a surface level understanding therefore it sucks".

 

While IKEMEN features an optional new code language more akin to traditional ones, it is not required, so CNS can still be used and supports all the new triggers, sctrls, and parameters; what the new language offers is code optimisation, temporary variables, functions, and loops, among other things. You're looking at it from the perspective of a player/spectator and not a developer, so obviously the plethora of new features aimed at developers are meaningless to you, but a godsend to them. MUGEN is terrible for actual game development, in part because of all the hardcoded features (that are freely editable in IKEMEN!), but also because you can't even sell the finished product (there's IKEMEN games already on Steam!).

 

Is not being able use cheap characters really an issue? That particular brand uses memory exploits that cannot (and should not) be made to work engine-side because neither engine shares any compiled code, so it's all different under the hood and the memory addresses don't align. You'd face this with any MUGEN clone.

 

If all you want to do is watch A.I. cockfights then stick with MUGEN. There isn't anything any engine could offer to enhance that experience.

There are IKEMEN games on STEAM???

[Dissidia]

2 hours ago, Randombambifan2 said:

There are IKEMEN games on STEAM???

Yes. Borghi's "The Black Heart" for example.

[snowy997]

Save for a few characters not working, Ikemen GO is just way better. Built in tag, interactive stages, more customization, online, it's just superior to Mugen in every way.

[KorosKoros]

On 7/23/2025 at 8:14 AM, Meldo said:

you say IKEMEN GO barely has any games made with it when the actual number of games is more significant than you think.

 

also how can you say you've experienced the engine when you never actually played it?

 

 

That's quite the fantastic list there. Thanks for that!

 

My opinion on the matter is this, I think that Mugen is the best and here's why.

 

Even with the memory issues and other extra stuff Ikemen can do that Mugen cannot. I think there is more accessibility and creative content OUTSIDE of trying to make something to sell on Steam or whatever. In essence like Jaashoouhh mention there is WAY more content for Mugen. Just because some Ikemen games are comming up NOW does not shadow what has already been made for Mugen. And alot of Ikemen games are just re-do's of older Mugen stuff. (This is not a complaint btw, just stating original content made EXCLUSIVLY on Ikemen not a Mugen remake.)

 

I may be bias and I can admit that, but having the freedom of WHAT characters you want in YOUR Mugen is a great feeling. Cheap/Null/Balanced/Unbalanced doesn't matter because it's up to the user. So I feel like it's a valid complaint that "CHEAPS" can not be used in Ikemen (Not sure what the reasoning behind this is but i'm going off what was stated) because that is an OPTION taken away from the user. Just saying, I feel its a valid complaint.

Spoiler

Winmugen gang for life.

 

Fuck the error in Line H tho.

 

[JaaShooUhh]

I'll just clarify my statement overall...

 

...IKEMEN does have a future, but right now, it is barely alive and will remain that way until people have NO REASON to keep using MUGEN.

 

Problem is, there are tons of reasons to keep using MUGEN that IKEMEN either does not do (i.e. not being playable on mobile devices), does do but most people won't use (i.e. online play), or does not allow (i.e. winMUGEN characters with the cheap coding).

 

Remember, winMUGEN is still the MOST POPULAR version of MUGEN in both China and Japan because a good portion of those communities, are people who make absurd characters that function with very specific coding exploits.

 

All I'm saying, is that I think IKEMEN will eventually become the future of the community, but right now, getting people to switch over, is going to be next to impossible. Aside from VERY SPECIFIC features that IKEMEN has, there really is NO REASON to switch over.

 

Y'all can point out all these features if you want, but you gotta remember... not everyone uses them or even wants them. For example the TAG feature, how many characters do you even see with this on MUGEN in the first place?

 

Not many. Aside from some MVC/MVC2 and CVS/CVS2 creations, most don't use this and don't even bother. Hence why UnoTag patcher exists, in case people actually do want to use these for whatever reason.

 

So, what about NETPLAY? Well, aside from CURATED and ORIGINAL games, how many people actually play online? I'd imagine not many, because MUGEN is inherently UNBALANCED. If I play ONLINE, I am going to want to use a character that I enjoy, that I practiced with, that I have even the SMALLEST amount of skill with.

 

Problem is, in most rosters, this character is fucking broken. He has dodge rolls, supercancels, parries, and even a "ghost" mode that makes him unable to be hit by projectiles. However, I play him because I am a button masher, but he is one of the few characters where even a scrub button masher like myself, can pull off some sick combos and moves out of sheer luck.

 

Let's see... IKEMEN has a built-in replay and recording function. That is neat, but not needed, since people can just use OBS or something.

 

IKEMEN has a random mode / test mode. I guess that is neat if you want to do just constant random matches like SaltyBet or SpriteClub, but like... RandomSelect already exists in MUGEN and MUGEN even has tools to run tournament modes and random battles, so once again... not needed to switch over yet.

 

What else... LUA scripting. That is neat, except for the fact that MOST people in the MUGEN community can barely even create characters as it is, so learning LUA also will probably tank them entirely. As for creators who are skilled, hey... I wish them the best of luck. As for literally everyone else who is just a gamer and not a coder... this does nothing for us, we don't create stuff for MUGEN as it is.

 

 

So yeah, aside from good coders and maybe a few specific features people want, there isn't much else to look forwards to.

 

Apparently its easier to make a Smash Bros clone in this (cause of platforming), so I guess for an even more niché sub-community of MUGEN that wants smash bros style of gameplay, that'll appeal to them.

 

Uhhh..  seems there is 3D or 2.5D support for levels or something, I guess that is neat... but I dunno how many people who prefer the 2D fighting games will care about that.

[Kasasagi]

On 7/23/2025 at 3:27 AM, JaaShooUhh said:

BARELY ALIVE (IKEMEN). People who have devoted years of their life, are NEVER going to move to IKEMEN unless absolutely necessary for a VERY SPECIFIC feature.

 

Ikemen GO's development is very alive on Github.

 

Also, you may or may not know, but POTS for example, is now one of the main active Ikemen GO developers and develops his characters for Ikemen GO.

 

[KorosKoros]

On 8/5/2025 at 10:09 AM, Kasasagi said:

 

Ikemen GO's development is very alive on Github.

 

Also, you may or may not know, but POTS for example, is now one of the main active Ikemen GO developers and develops his characters for Ikemen GO.

 

I did not know that, but that is VERY promising news. He is such a wonderful creator. 

 

I did recently see some cool stuff being implemented in Ikemen GO that I thought was pretty cool so I want to also share with you guys here.

 

In game points shop! (Just like the old days before DLC was a thing!)

 

Achievement System!

 

 

Honestly quite impressive and promising stuff. I look forward to seeing this come along!

[Noside]

I like to use Mugen over Ikemen even to this day, I just want a simple fun fighting game like a regular street figher or mortal kombat, not interested in achievements or stuff like that.

[JaaShooUhh]

2 hours ago, Noside said:

I like to use Mugen over Ikemen even to this day, I just want a simple fun fighting game like a regular street figher or mortal kombat, not interested in achievements or stuff like that.

That's what I keep saying.

 

Like, IKEMEN keeps adding features, but none of these things MOST people actually want.

 

ACHIEVEMENTS are really for people who need constant dopamine and stimulation to enjoy a game.

 

I'll be real, if they want to win people over, they need to add things that nearly EVERYONE can either use or want.

 

Like the tag system is nice, but they could go one step further and just copy Add004 by making it also into a MVC striker system as well.

 

How about this... copy Kagure Yaro, and make an in-app fighter creator. Something so that people who can't code, can still make decent characters.

 

If something like that was added, I'd be willing to switch to IKEMEN for good. Imagine, you load up IKEMEN, you access a CREATE-A-FIGHTER function, you pick the moves you want, it pre-sets up the hitboxes based on the non-transparent parts of the sprite, then it has like uhh... sliders or something for deciding move speed or stats or something.

 

Or better yet, I'm willing to switch over, if they add a universal way to mix and match different features from fighting games onto ANY character.

 

For example, imagine you add some MK characters, but they all can parry and combo breaker.

 

I think that'd be neat. Point is... they seem to add things that MOST people are not going to use or NEVER going to deal with and forcefully turn off because of how obnoxious it is.

 

 

 

Also please... make a MOBILE PORT of IKEMEN. Having to use Winlator to run it (and it barely works or never works) sucks ass.

[PlasmoidThunder]

Again, Ikemen is a game engine. It's not going to add bloat like a character creator when the vast majority of games won't use it. Nonstandard features are what modules are for, which whoa hey look at that.

 

You have to understand that Ikemen is a collaborative effort by volunteers, so base features that get added are made by people who want to add them.

[Meldo]

19 hours ago, JaaShooUhh said:

Also please... make a MOBILE PORT of IKEMEN. Having to use Winlator to run it (and it barely works or never works) sucks ass.

y'know you could buy yourself a PC to save yourself the trouble. heck, even the cheapest laptop is powerful enough to run the engine.

[Kasasagi]

On 9/3/2025 at 11:29 PM, JaaShooUhh said:

ACHIEVEMENTS are really for people who need constant dopamine and stimulation to enjoy a game.

 

I'll be real, if they want to win people over, they need to add things that nearly EVERYONE can either use or want.

 

The achievements video is from Ikemen Plus Ultra, a one-man made custom fork of Ikemen, it is not from the official Ikemen GO.

 

If you want to know what is currently worked on in the official Ikemen GO, look at the changelog: https://github.com/ikemen-engine/Ikemen-GO/commits/develop/

 

Examples of some recent things: Rollback Netcode, Bugfixes, Input/Commands System, Mugen Compatibility and a notable lack of "ACHIEVEMENTS"

[jrm1007 - Rin]

I know this thread is nearly a year old but I'd still like to throw my 2 cents in.

"First off, it is compatible with MORE devices and systems than IKEMEN. The fact that I can't even run IKEMEN on my phone, yet I am able to play PS Vita games and Xbox 360 games on my phone, says a lot about how poorly handled IKEMEN has been."

 

Ikemen GO is using an entirely different coding platform from MUGEN, it's in the name. There's a chance the Coding Platform has compatibility issues with the Consoles in question. However, unlike MUGEN which was closed source, Ikemen Go's Open Source nature will make porting much more easy in the future, since you won't have to waste thousands of hours trying to open it up.

 

"It takes a LOT of effort to pursue something new, that is either currently DEAD (Knuckle Fighter), DYING (2D Fighter Maker 2nd), or BARELY ALIVE (IKEMEN). People who have devoted years of their life, are NEVER going to move to IKEMEN unless absolutely necessary for a VERY SPECIFIC feature." 

"Thirdly, if characters made in MUGEN are COMPATIBLE with IKEMEN, then coding MUGEN characters is still the better option, because then they are compatible with MUGEN as well, making them MORE LIKELY to be used in the first place."

 

Even if they don't make Ikemen GO exclusive content, they can still make the switch. I've played WinMUGEN, 1.0, and 1.1b, speaking from experience, Ikemen GO has to be the most stable of all four I've used. Very minimal crashes or bugs for that matter, I'm sure many others can agree. Not only that but it also has support for features that were broken in 1.0/1.1b, such as FreqMul. On top of also having support for 1.0/1.1b features, including the 1.1b SFF, OpenGL Render, and recently now having Vulkan support.

 

Sure they may not be making EXCLUSIVE content, they still make the switch regardless because Ikemen GO provides a much more stable experience, and you won't have to play in fear of crashing from simply playing the Arcade Mode.

 

"Also, the fact that we can't use cheap characters AT ALL, makes IKEMEN even more lame. Hell, there are winMUGEN patches that let me use 1.0 characters on them and even ways to downgrade 1.0 and 1.1 characters back to winMUGEN simply by editing some code."

First off, it's called "Cheapie" not "Cheap" saying Ikemen Go is bad because you can't win a match within 5 seconds is completely absurd. Second. WinMUGEN having 1.0/1.1b downgrade patches is not relevant to your current point. You're just throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks.

 

I'd go over more points, but it seems everyone else here beat me to it.