[Gen6] Tier List: Shaymin-S banned from Doubles OU (08/20/15)

[Glisp]

So, where's Crawdaunt on this list? This is gonna sound weird, but I like Crawdaunt.

[Galvatron]

So, where's Crawdaunt on this list? This is gonna sound weird, but I like Crawdaunt.

I beleive Crawdaunt is under the RU category but I not entirely sure. :-P

[Glisp]

I know his base stats are somewhere in the 300's. I wanna say 308 or 380 but I'm not sure. Need to check.... oh no, it's actually 468. That's pretty solid for a base stat total considering the average is between 400 and 600 currently iirc. http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Crawdaunt_%28Pok%C3%A9mon%29#Base_stats

 

Judging by the distribution, I guess I should make my Crawdaunt focus more on physical attacks. I think mine knows Swords Dance too.

[RicePigeon]

Crawdaunt is under BL

 

 

Also updated the tier lists with the recent Greninja ban

[Glisp]

ah, thanks.

[RicePigeon]

If you want a more accurate gauge of how well Crawdaunt fares competitively, I suggest taking a look at the Viability rankings thread. For the record, Crawdaunt is currently B rank in OU (the only tier where its currently allowed other than Ubers), as a powerful, albeit slow, physical wallbreaker.

[Glisp]

So, basically he can counter walls like Slaking and Blissey?

[RicePigeon]

Slaking sucks as a wall (and in general) and Blissey is outclassed by Chansey but that's the general idea. The only walls/defensive Pokemon it has problems breaking through are Chesnaught, Mega Venusaur, Gyarados, and bulky Mega Altaria.

[RicePigeon]

Serperior, Mega Pidgeot, and Dragalge are all being suspect tested to be banned from RU:
 

Ability: Tangled Feet (No Guard) / Item: @Pidgeotite
Nature: Timid w/ EVs: 4 Defense / 252 Sp.Attack / 252 Speed
Moves: Hurricane / Heat Wave / U-Turn, Hidden Power [Grass], or Work Up / Roost or Hidden Power [Grass]

Ability: Tangled Feet (No Guard) / Item: @Pidgeotite
Nature: Timid w/ EVs: 4 Defense / 252 Sp.Attack / 252 Speed
Moves: Hurricane / Work Up / Substitute or Refresh / Roost

 

ORAS gave Pidgeot a new Mega Evolution, with 135 base Special Attack and access to a 100% accurate 110 BP Flying-type STAB move. Access to Heat Wave allows Mega Pidgeot to hit Steel-types on the switch in, and U-turn allows it to pivot out of other counters such as Eelektross and Rhyperior on the switch-in quite easily. Access to Roost and Work Up allow Pidgeot to take advantage of more passive counters such as Bronzong, SpD Golbat, and Registeel, (Refresh is also an option to take advantage of these Pokemon). Mega Pidgeot is very difficult for offensive teams to deal with as its high 121 base speed outspeeds almost all non scarf Pokemon in the tier (Jolteon and Mega Sceptile (post Mega Evolution) are the lone exceptions). This allows Mega Pidgeot to clean up with very little support against offensive teams.

 

Ability: Contrary / Item: @Life Orb
Nature: Timid w/ EVs: 4 Defense / 252 Sp.Attack / 252 Speed
Moves: Leaf Storm / Substitute or Giga Drain / Dragon Pulse / Hidden Power [Fire]

Ability: Contrary / Item: @Leftovers
Nature: Timid w/ EVs: 4 Defense / 252 Sp.Attack / 252 Speed
Moves: Leaf Storm / Substitute / Leech Seed / Hidden Power [Fire], Hidden Power [Rock], or Dragon Pulse
 
With the release of Contrary, Serperior gained a 130 BP STAB boosted Nasty Plot making it an extremely potent threat in spite of its base 75 SpA. Its really great base speed of 113, combined with its decent coverage (Grass + Dragon + Fire hits everything at least neutrally) allow Serperior to become a potent set up sweeper. While there are some decent defensive responses to Serperior, and quite a few things that can revenge kill it (less than you'd think thanks to its solid bulk for an offensive Pokemon), Serperior's free fourth moveslot allows it to cripple some would be counters and checks. Substitute+Leech Seed allows Serp to avoid status moves from the likes of Registeel and Bronzong while wearing them down with repeated chip damage in the process, Knock Off can wear down the opponents counters easily letting Serp sweep late game (Golbat, Bronzong) and Glare can be used to punish would be revenge killers (Scarf Moltres). Serperior does have a pretty solid counter in SpD Golbat, as well as a myriad of checks, but the ease with which it can sweep makes Serperior a suspect worthy threat.

 

Ability: Adaptability / Item: @Choice Specs or Draco Plate
Nature: Modest w/ EVs: 200 HP / 252 Sp.Attack / 56 Speed
Moves: Draco Meteor / Sludge Bomb / Dragon Pulse, Hidden Power [Fire], or Toxic Spikes / Focus Blast or Hidden Power [Fire]
 
With the release of Adaptability, Dragalge has become [RU's] premier wallbreaker with its powerful STAB moves. On top of its power, Dragalge is also pretty bulky for an offensive Pokemon, and has extremely good defensive typing, giving it countless opportunities to easily switch in and fire off its ridiculously powerful STAB moves with impunity, often getting a free KO in the process. Because of its immense power, Dragalge has a *very* limited number of switch-ins, limited to the most Specially Bulky of Steel-type Pokemon in the tier, and all of them barring Bronzong fear switching into a common coverage move or simply don't have the bulk to take repeated hits over the course of the game, which makes Dragalge quite centralizing in the current metagame. To put just how hard Dragalge hits into perspective, Dragalge's Draco Meteor is *significantly* more powerful than Exploud's Boomburst on its initial use, and Sludge Bomb is almost as powerful.

252+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 295-348 (73 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Dragalge Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 382-450 (94.5 - 111.3%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Dragalge Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 264-312 (65.3 - 77.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

[Galvatron]

I didn't know Dragalge has adaptability. hmm...., looks like its time to for me to breed another one.

[RicePigeon]

February Tier updates.

 

 

 

Rises

: UU to OU

: BL to OU

: UU to OU

: BL to OU

: UU to OU

: UU to OU

: UU to OU

: RU to UU

: BL2 to UU

: RU to UU

: RU to UU

: RU to UU

: BL2 to UU

: RU to BL2

: NU to RU

: BL3 to RU

: NU to RU

: NU to RU

: BL4 to NU

: PU to NU

: PU to NU

 

Drops

: OU to UU

: OU to BL

: OU to UU

: OU to UU

: OU to UU

: OU to UU

: RU to NU

: NU to PU

: RU to NU

: RU to NU

: RU to NU

: RU to NU

: NU to PU

: NU to PU

: NU to PU
 

[Galvatron]

Mega-Diancie is beginning to be more used now a days and quite dangerous since she can learn "Earth Power' from tutor to counter some Steel-type threats. :-P

[RicePigeon]

You also forgot Hidden Power Fire and its sexy 160/160/110 offensive stats, ability to run a multitude of roles (rock polish sweeper, calm mind sweeper, support, all out mixed attacker, Trick Room setter, stallbreaking with Magic Bounce, etc).

[Galvatron]

You also forgot Hidden Power Fire and its sexy 160/160/110 offensive stats, ability to run a multitude of roles (rock polish sweeper, calm mind sweeper, support, all out mixed attacker, Trick Room setter, stallbreaking with Magic Bounce, etc).

Yeah! she can perform alot of tastics with those stats which is why she is very demandable on GTS.

[RicePigeon]

And JUST after I posted the tier update, Mega Pinsir just got quickbanned from UU:
 

 
 

Mega Pinsir sets itself as one of the strongest and most devastating sweepers to ever be introduced into the UU tier. Coming down from its supremacy in OU where it was nearly suspect tested there, Mega Pinsir combines ridiculous offensive stats, Aerilate, Flying and Fighting/Ground type coverage, STAB Flying priority and Swords Dance to give it almost 0 defensive or offensive answers. It is also not like Crawdaunt or Bisharp in that it still boasts 105 base Speed, a benchmark that means it outspeeds offensive Pokemon such as Krookodile, Nidos, Shaymin, Flygon, Entei and Hydreigon. Mega Pinsir is without a doubt too powerful for UU, and with the reasoning above is why it is being quickbanned from the UU metagame.

EDIT: Small Doubles update:

 

 

Rises

: DUU -> DOU

: DUU -> DOU

 

 

Drops
: DOU -> DUU

: DOU -> DUU

: DOU -> DUU

: DOU -> DUU

: DOU -> DUU

[RicePigeon]

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/np-uu-stage-2-uptown-funk-you-up.3528903/page-6#post-6035826

 

With a 130 BP STAB move that boosts its Special Attack by two stages, a great base Speed of 113, and a decent set of utility moves, Serperior is an extremely potent sweeper. Unlike other setup sweepers, it doesn't have to use a turn setting up where it's vulnerable to opposing attacks or status; it can simply revenge kill a weakened Pokemon and set up on the same turn. There is a large number of Pokemon on which it can set up, including every bulky Water- or Ground-type in the tier, which are staples on most teams. Serperior's third and fourth move options allow it to cripple or flat out beat some checks or counters: Glare can cripple faster switchins including Scarfers, while Taunt + Synthesis allows it to beat every special wall that tries to status or phaze it. In addition, it's Speed tier limits the Pokemon that can reliably revenge kill it to Scarfers or faster Pokemon with a super effective move. Slower offensive answers take a huge amount of damage from +2 Leaf Storm; for example Chandelure is OHKO'd after Stealth Rock. Because of this, Serperior has very few reliable answers in the current metagame and thus is a huge restriction to teambuilding.

 

Terrakion is easily one of the most versatile wallbreakers, with access to both Rock Polish and Swords Dance. Its incredible offensive movepool and dual STAB offensive coverage makes it nearly unbeatable with proper team support. Although the tier has been shifting to a more offensive metagame, Terrakion simply overwhelms any defensive checks, with Doublade being the main way to get around it. However, the argument that one pokemon can mitigate the offensive pressure off the tier is incorrect, as Terrakion has the movepool to prepare for absolutely any situation that it needs.

 

Serperior and Terrakion both quickbanned from UU

[RicePigeon]

Mega Metagross OU suspect test is now underway

[RicePigeon]

Moltres and Pangoro are being suspect tested for RU

 

 

Moltres's fantastic Special Attack stat and high base power STAB moves in Fire Blast and Hurricane make it quite difficult to switch into.On top this, Moltres has a solid Speed tier that lets it get the jump on a large amount of the relevant metagame. Access to Roost punishes defensive switching and lets it recover off damage taken from weaker attacks, Stealth Rock, and Life Orb recoil, and Moltres can easily fit Hidden Power Grass onto its sets to deal with many of its offensive checks such as Kabutops and Rhyperior. Because of this, Moltres often forces teams to fodder a Pokemon or win prediction battles unless they choose to run a dedicated Moltres switch in ; Cresselia, Slowking, Regirock, and Lanturn are the main options here and all of them have their own issues,Regirock and Lanturn suffer from a lack of recovery, making them easy to wear down, while Slowking and Cresselia are vulnerable to Pursuit.

Choice Scarf Moltres has little trouble ripping through offensive teams between its blazing speed, great special attack, access to U-turn, and high base power STAB moves

On the downside, it's at least slightly easier to keep hazards on the opponent's side of the field now that Gligar's moved up to UU by usage, and Stealth Rock is as much of a thorn in Moltres's side as usual. Although whether or not this is enough to keep Moltres from being banworthy remains to be seen.

 

 

Pangoro's great attack stat and incredible coverage with its STAB moves alone make it extremely hard (if not impossible) to safely switch into. Pangoro's Swords Dance set is pretty much impossible for slower, defensive teams to deal with, as it easily breaks through most common stall Pokemon at +2 with Knock Off, Drain Punch, or Gunk Shot, can set up quite easily, and can keep itself healthy throughout the match thanks to Drain Punch. Even Quagsire, who would otherwise easily stop Swords Dance Pangoro, is incapable of beating it thanks to Mold Breaker. On top of this, Swords Dance Pangoro is not even dead weight against other playstyles, as a STAB Knock Off, coming off of its high attack stat often forces the opponent to sacrifice one or more Pokemon. Pangoro is also capable of pulling off an extremely threatening Choice Band set thanks to its astounding attack stat, great STAB moves (in particular, Knock Off is *extremely* spammable), and perfect coverage. While having no defensive counters isn't necessarily grounds for banning a Pokemon, it is certainly grounds for suspecting it, especially when it can just run right through a playstyle so consistently.

[RicePigeon]

A few minor tier shifts;
 
Rises:
: RU -> BL2 (Banned via Suspect Test)

: RU -> BL2 (Banned via Suspect Test)

: NU -> BL3 (Banned via Suspect Test)

: NU -> RU

: NU -> RU

: NU -> RU

: NU -> RU

: NU -> RU

 

Drops:
: UU -> RU

[RicePigeon]

The OU suspect test for Mega Metagross is over; Mega Metagross stays in OU
 

 

Voting phase is over. Here are the results:

Number of eligible voters: 335
Number of votes: 314
Ban: 180 (57,3%)
Do Not Ban: 134 (42,7%)

Metagrossite doesn't achieve the required 60% pro-ban supermajority.

For these reasons, Mega-Metagross will remain in OU.

[Galvatron]

Hmm. i see

 

you know I'm surprised Metagross dosn't know Levitate ability in mega-form. I bet that situation would had got this pokemon Banned quickly. :-P

[RicePigeon]

The reason it was being brought up for a ban was because of its perfect combination of bulk, speed, and offense, Levitate would have taken the latter away.

[RicePigeon]

Feraligatr has been banned from both RU and NU:

 

Gaining Sheer Force gave Feraligatr three crucial boons that resulted in its ban: the ability to hit tremendously hard straight off the bat, have the capability to run Dragon Dance and even Specially Based-attacker sets to limit its pool of checks, and accentuate the power of its already fearsome Swords Dance sets. Between its above average bulk and pure Water typing, Feraligatr found many opportunities to set up all the while being incredibly difficult to revenge kill once it got going. This significant increase in power made Feraligatr very difficult to check and nearly impossible to counter outside of a select few defensive Pokemon, especially when it employs the use of Substitute, and outside of Choice Scarf Rotom-C, very few if any Choice Scarf users have the capability to revenge kill it. In the end, the addition of Sheer Force made Feraligatr, an already good RU Pokemon, too powerful and versatile for the RU metagame to handle.

[RicePigeon]

So Smogon feels that Origin Giratina should fall out of Ubers and join the ranks of OU

 

 

Hi guys, the tiering OU Council, in order to achieve a balanced and diverse metagame has decided to suspect test Giratina-Origin this round.

After removing from the metagame numerous offensive powerhouses, we realized that the time had come to invert the course. Presently, the OU metagame is stale and the abundance of defensively oriented teams led us to believe that a mixed attacker with great defensive and offensive typing will probably give back some vivacity to the tier. Right at the beginning of the X/Y era, many people suggested that Giratina-Origin shouldn't have been included in the initial banlist. Its base statistics are on par with those of several other Pokémon who characterize the current OU metagame and the fact that it's forced to run Griseous Orb makes Giratina-O a relatively predictable threat. Likewise, according to top players of the caliber of gr8astard and McMeghan, Giratina-O's 150/100/100 defenses will help balanced teams deal with threats such as Charizard-Y, Landorus-I and Serperior.

[Dumanios]

Well now